Truss Rods in Classical Guitars

[Alphonsus Jr.]

What's your position on this?

[thomas]

Post by Alphonsus Jr.
What's your position on this?

Not always necessary, but nice to have anyway. Because when you need one you really need it.

[Andrew Schulman]

Post by Alphonsus Jr.
What's your position on this?

Why do you ask?

Andrew

[a***@gmail.com]

Post by Andrew Schulman

Post by Alphonsus Jr.
What's your position on this?

Why do you ask?
Andrew

Good question!

[d***@gmail.com]

Post by Alphonsus Jr.
What's your position on this?

Ask yourself if Thomas Aquinnas would have used one,and you'll find the answer you seek.

[Andrew Schulman]

Post by d***@gmail.com

Post by Alphonsus Jr.
What's your position on this?

Ask yourself if Thomas Aquinnas would have used one,and you'll find the answer you seek.

(It begins.)

Andrew

[Richard Jernigan]

Post by Andrew Schulman
(It begins.)
Andrew

"Shall we their fond pageant see?
. . . ."

RNJ

[Andrew Schulman]

Post by Richard Jernigan

Post by Andrew Schulman
(It begins.)
Andrew

"Shall we their fond pageant see?
  . . . ."

A Midnight Summer's Dream, and I didn't even have to Google it!

I just lied, I DID have to Google it.

Sigh...

Andrew

[Richard Jernigan]

Post by Andrew Schulman
A Midnight Summer's Dream, and I didn't even have to Google it!
I just lied, I DID have to Google it.

The next line is far better known.

RNJ

Post by Andrew Schulman
Sigh...
Andrew

[John Nguyen]

Post by Andrew Schulman
I just lied, I DID have to Google it.
Sigh...
Andrew

Sorry! You cannot be qualified as a politician!
Sigh..

John

[Benoit Meulle-Stef]

They are great, even some maker from Spain have started to use them ,Camps guitars use a double action titanium truss rod in there hight models, I followed there idea and put one in my nylon guitars as well now...

Benoit

[d***@gmail.com]

Post by Benoit Meulle-Stef
They are great, even some maker from Spain have started to use them ,Camps guitars use a double action titanium truss rod in there hight models, I followed there idea and put one in my nylon guitars as well now...
Benoit

Yer, a dumb ass!

[Benoit Meulle-Stef]

Post by d***@gmail.com

Post by Benoit Meulle-Stef
They are great, even some maker from Spain have started to use them ,Camps guitars use a double action titanium truss rod in there hight models, I followed there idea and put one in my nylon guitars as well now...
Benoit

Yer, a dumb ass!

Whom I have the privilege to be insulted by?

Benoit

[Kevin Hall]

Post by d***@gmail.com

Post by Benoit Meulle-Stef
They are great, even some maker from Spain have started to use them
,Camps guitars use a double action titanium truss rod in there hight
models, I followed there idea and put one in my nylon guitars as well
now...
Benoit

Yer, a dumb ass!

For a change I agree completely with Ben. If you can improve control of a
neck with no deleterious effect on sound, who could possibly object, other
than a guy who thinks Tom Aquinas was a luthier?

Modern lightweight adjustable rods permit the builder far more latitude in
terms of neck thickness, contour and even material than older methods.
Given the rapidly diminishing supply of woods like honduras mahog. and first
rate ebony it is only prudent for builders to explore other materials and
construction methods. If they do not then future generations of
anal-retentive, hide-bound traditionalists will be gnashing their teeth
because they can't find guitars to play and complain about.

I've seen the 'no rods' brigade stopped dead in their tracks when shown that
some of their much-ballyhooed 'purist' instruments actually had an
adjustable rod hidden within, often with access to the adjuster cleverly
concealed under the nut.

While Ben and I sometimes knock lumps off each other on another forum I
recognize that he is a talented working builder and probably understands far
more about how instruments actually work than the vast majority of players,
'purists' or otherwise. His position on rods is rational and based on
experience, facts and good sense.

KH

[Benoit Meulle-Stef]

Dear Kevin:
Thanks for the help here. I do sometime disagree with you, but admires your work and respect you as a fine craftsman. I don't like answers like "If Torres didn't do it so it's must be wrong". Puritanism is another world for close minded...
Take care
Benoît

[dsi1]

Post by Benoit Meulle-Stef
They are great, even some maker from Spain have started to use them ,Camps guitars use a double action titanium truss rod in there hight models, I followed there idea and put one in my nylon guitars as well now...
Benoit

Carbon rods would probably be ok in a classical neck or better yet,
guitars with more than 6 strings. I can't see where double truss rods
make sense in 6 string classical guitars unless you can insure that
there's some way of putting some pre-load on the truss system. The
worst thing you can have is two loose rods in a guitar neck.

[Benoit Meulle-Stef]

Post by dsi1
Carbon rods would probably be ok in a classical neck or better yet,
guitars with more than 6 strings. I can't see where double truss rods
make sense in 6 string classical guitars unless you can insure that
there's some way of putting some pre-load on the truss system. The
worst thing you can have is two loose rods in a guitar neck.

I use adjustable truss rod because of modern days, people travels a lot and guitar necks can react quite dramatically to big humidity and heat changes..; So to be on the safe side, truss rods is the way to go...

Anonymous: What a hell are you saying???

[Dick Cheney]

Post by Benoit Meulle-Stef

Post by dsi1
Carbon rods would probably be ok in a classical neck or better yet,
guitars with more than 6 strings. I can't see where double truss rods
make sense in 6 string classical guitars unless you can insure that
there's some way of putting some pre-load on the truss system. The
worst thing you can have is two loose rods in a guitar neck.

I use adjustable truss rod because of modern days, people travels a lot and guitar necks can react quite dramatically to big humidity and heat changes..; So to be on the safe side, truss rods is the way to go...
Anonymous: What a hell are you saying???

Anonymous is buddy, Mike.
Do you make classical guitars? don't you rip the wood, flip the grain
and put a strip of something like ebony in the middle? It doesn't seem
like that should warp to me. If my guitar had a truss rod, I'd feel
rightly or wrongly, something was wrong with it

[Cactus Wren]

You mean, if you woke up one day and there was all of a sudden a truss
rod in your guitar?

If my guitar had a truss rod, I'd feel

Post by Dick Cheney
rightly or wrongly, something was wrong with it

[dsi1]

Post by Cactus Wren
You mean, if you woke up one day and there was all of a sudden a truss
rod in your guitar?
If my guitar had a truss rod, I'd feel

Post by Dick Cheney
rightly or wrongly, something was wrong with it

A truss rod in a classical guitar sounds kinda radical. A carbon
graphite rod doesn't seem out of place since some guitar makers have
been embedding a block of ebony or hard wood into a guitar neck for a
long time. Same principal - mostly.

[Alphonsus Jr.]

Post by dsi1

Post by Cactus Wren
You mean, if you woke up one day and there was all of a sudden a truss
rod in your guitar?
If my guitar had a truss rod, I'd feel

Post by Dick Cheney
rightly or wrongly, something was wrong with it

A truss rod in a classical guitar sounds kinda radical. A carbon
graphite rod doesn't seem out of place since some guitar makers have
been embedding a block of ebony or hard wood into a guitar neck for a
long time. Same principal - mostly.

Check this out:

[a***@gmail.com]

Post by Alphonsus Jr.

Post by dsi1

Post by Cactus Wren
You mean, if you woke up one day and there was all of a sudden a truss
rod in your guitar?
If my guitar had a truss rod, I'd feel

Post by Dick Cheney
rightly or wrongly, something was wrong with it

A truss rod in a classical guitar sounds kinda radical. A carbon
graphite rod doesn't seem out of place since some guitar makers have
been embedding a block of ebony or hard wood into a guitar neck for a
long time. Same principal - mostly.

http://youtu.be/XukEmT7H7PA

I can't watch a 15 minute Cordoba commercial. What's the point? does one come with a gig bag and truss rod?

[dsi1]

Post by Alphonsus Jr.
http://youtu.be/XukEmT7H7PA

Looks like the company may have made truss rods in their guitars work
for them. I'm impressed that any guitar company would say that they're
committed to nylon string guitars. It's almost insane to hear someone
say that!

[Benoit Meulle-Stef]

Again, graphite or ebony slap is fine, until you have a major shift in humidity: one of my customers went to give lessons in Brazil for a couple of month and went he came back the neck of his 6500 euro hand made Spanish guitar with center slap of ebony was a big brown banana...

Benoit

[Alan Carruth]

Reinforcing the neck with ebony or CF can limit the amount it will pull up under the sustained load of the strings, but won't keep it from happening to some extent. An adjustable truss rod counteracts the string pull, and eliminates the problem.

One of my students made himself a couple of titanium truss rods for guitars he built here. They worked well, and did not add appreciable weight to the neck.

[dsi1]

Post by Benoit Meulle-Stef
Again, graphite or ebony slap is fine, until you have a major shift in humidity: one of my customers went to give lessons in Brazil for a couple of month and went he came back the neck of his 6500 euro hand made Spanish guitar with center slap of ebony was a big brown banana...
Benoit

Thanks for the info. I just don't like the idea of having a rod that's
not under tension i.e., loose in a neck. I also hate playing big brown
bananas...

[Benoit Meulle-Stef]

If the truss rod is properly installed you should not have any problem with rattling...
Benoit

[dsi1]

Post by Benoit Meulle-Stef
If the truss rod is properly installed you should not have any problem with rattling...
Benoit

Thanks for the info, and thanks for the beautiful documentation on your
instrument builds.

[Benoit Meulle-Stef]

Post by dsi1

Post by Benoit Meulle-Stef
If the truss rod is properly installed you should not have any problem with rattling...
Benoit

Thanks for the info, and thanks for the beautiful documentation on your
instrument builds.

De nada
benoît

[John Huff]

Post by Alphonsus Jr.
What's your position on this?

The traditional methods for "classical" instruments would be to strengthen the neck, perhaps with a plain ebony rod, and use a Stauffer style neck adjustment for changing the action as needed.

It makes more sense to use carbon fibre than ebony these days, it seems. The Smallman variant of the Stauffer neck adjuster makes more sense on a modern day guitar.

I've tried a couple of Australian classicals with truss rods. The neck is heavier. I suspect there may be some resulting effect on the sound - whether this is good or bad probably depends on the construction of the body.

[David Raleigh Arnold]

Post by John Huff

Post by Alphonsus Jr.
What's your position on this?

The traditional methods for "classical" instruments would be to
strengthen the neck, perhaps with a plain ebony rod, and use a Stauffer
style neck adjustment for changing the action as needed.
It makes more sense to use carbon fibre than ebony these days, it seems.
The Smallman variant of the Stauffer neck adjuster makes more sense on a
modern day guitar.
I've tried a couple of Australian classicals with truss rods. The neck
is heavier. I suspect there may be some resulting effect on the sound -
whether this is good or bad probably depends on the construction of the
body.

The neck does not *have* to be heavier.

Stable hardwood is not as easy to get as it used to be,
and that justifies whatever is necessary IMO. Regards,
daveA

[Benoit Meulle-Stef]

To prevent heavy neck, did I mention titanium? Yes, I this I did... Stay away from heavy steel ones for sure it will affect the tone...

Benoît

[David Raleigh Arnold]

Post by Benoit Meulle-Stef
To prevent heavy neck, did I mention titanium? Yes, I this I did... Stay
away from heavy steel ones for sure it will affect the tone...
Benoît

Did I mention the coefficient of expansion? No, I
didn't. Regards, daveA